Your student has the confidence and fire to make a bold assertion that takes you by surprise and requires your considered response. This is rare and admirable in a young writer, especially a woman. Perhaps (I hope) her position will moderate over time. Jeanette Winterson says in her memoir of a mother’s war on her spirit, “I cannot remember a time when I was not setting my version of the story against hers” (I’m paraphrasing from memory). You could call this memoir an act of revenge, but I doubt if this description applies to all of Winterson’s work. In a mature writer, I look for nuance. I think most mature readers do. Winterson’s “revenge” memoir is also a tribute to reading, which saved her. I didn’t intend to go on and on, but the proposition is so interesting.
Rona, precisely! That is what I so cherished about these students of mine. Nothing was set in stone. Nothing that I said was the final word. Everything caused me to reconsider. And here is something I've been turning over for nearly a year now—or perhaps nine months. I love the responses here, and how all of you are adding to the discussion, layering nuance in, meaning. Writing is a collective search. It is never one definitive answer. (And I love the Winterson, remember that quote just as you do. You and I might have the same memory.)
Provocative. I might agree with your student in the sense of why are we even writing the book if one part of us isn't inherently thinking, I want them all to listen to ME. But I have to ponder a bit more.
Leslie, I was actually thinking about you when I was writing (and rewriting) this. I was thinking how rounded your stories are, how dimensional, how fierce and yet how not revenge. I think we all write for our very own reasons. My own work, for example, has a small audience so I never really think about being heard. I write because I'm physically unwell when I don't. I publish here because it gives me a sense of completion and bc I adore this community. Those are just my reasons — my weird personal stuff. In any case, I think in the end it comes down to this: Listen to me because my version of this story is the only possible version of this story. Or listen to me because I have worked so hard to understand and this is where I come down on things.
How I wish we could sort this out for ourselves over a cup of coffee/glass of wine! Thanks, as always, for making me think, for reminding me of the urgency of our work. xoxox
I agree with you, Beth. I thought of my own writing, my own motives, as I read this. Yes...there are times when I write with a need to be right...to stick it to the man (he may or may not be orange), but much of my writing comes from my desire to pave the way for others...and I'd rather have a heart filled with love and compassion rather than anger and revenge any day.
I've written early drafts that feel one dimensional to me. When I read through them I realize that complexity will not just tell a truer story. It will tell a better one. But sometimes, Linda, actions or people defy compassion. And so we make our choices, with the facts as they are. You are always compassionate, in the posts that I read.
Yes...there are people I can't make look better if I'm truthful. I do always have that old idiom in my mind, "Hurt people hurt people." It doesn't excuse behavior, as we all have a choice, but it helps me to keep from ending up a bitter old woman. LOL
I've heard it said that writing itself is an act of revenge, an "I'll show them I really can do this!" Meaning not that the content of the writing is vengeful, but the very act of speaking out is an assertion, a triumph, and in some ways a revenge. I can sort of see that point but don't fully agree with it and don't think of it as absolute.
The older I get, the fewer absolutes I see. I don't know what I could ever say about "all of writing" that would be universally true! So there's another question: *Are* there any absolutes, *anything* that is true of "every book?"
Oh, Jenn. I love this perspective. This perhaps. This no absolutes. Today is feeling so very dark to me. Nothing certain. Hoping beyond all definitions for compassion. In the world. And in our work.
Jenn, I had a similar idea related to the act of speaking out rather than the words themselves. When I saw the title of the post, my immediate thought was that writing, getting words out there (no matter the size of the audience), is an act of revenge against those trying to extinguish creativity, love, beauty, and the sacred from our world. Not all writing does this, but I think the idea applies to those of us writing to mine the deeper parts of our existence.
Monica, this post has brought in so many interesting voices, so many points of view—the perfect Substack gathering. I read your words, sit back, and think about who tries to extinguish us, and why. And then remember all those who say, We're listening. We're here. Go on. A tempestuous sea of yes and no out there, as we write.
I think we see everything through the lens we were trained in, and later others’ lens we try on along the way, which colors how we view and see self and other. And since another’s lens isn’t our truth, it’s a layered life we acquire and attempt to navigate. I’ve been thinking about the word “complexity” for years along with “vulnerability,” these words, which perhaps, we impose upon our lives and writing. I wonder if at times, they’re used as bulwarks to keep others from asking of us the hard questions, and to ward off our asking ourselves the same. So perhaps in writing towards perceived complexity, we’ll peel those layers, and a perspective will be revealed that allows us to trust ourselves.
Char, I really do believe that if we keep asking the hard questions about the whole story we will find the version that is most true to ourselves. The one that we can and will defend for all of time, knowing that we have dug deep, knowing that we've given the tale the full 360 degrees.
Janey, oh, and now I sit with your note and ponder it. I would never want any of my posts to feel like acts of insistence. Only of the suggested: Perhaps let's look at this in a new way..... perhaps.
My family history is complicated - my brother's memories, his questioning of mine, and my son's similar questions about his childhood have thrown up all sorts of uncertainties.
But it is certainly an interesting idea...I wonder who your student was quoting? And did they pursue the line of thought? 🤔
"Uncertanties" must be the Word of the Week, Janey, as my stack yesterday was on uncertainty (lol) and how it clears the deck of future and past, can bring a new seeing of life.:)
Very interesting. I disagree with the student, but I admire her pluck. She may be revengeful, but I certainly am not. Perhaps she will be more successful than I have been as a result, but we all have to write our stories, fictional or true(ish).
Oh, much to think about here. Perhaps, anger and the need to write our own version of events gets us to the page, but I don’t think we can end there. Or else, we become stuck in that hard place. For me, there must be movement toward light, toward a redemption, not necessarily of the other, but of our own life and journey.
Your student has the confidence and fire to make a bold assertion that takes you by surprise and requires your considered response. This is rare and admirable in a young writer, especially a woman. Perhaps (I hope) her position will moderate over time. Jeanette Winterson says in her memoir of a mother’s war on her spirit, “I cannot remember a time when I was not setting my version of the story against hers” (I’m paraphrasing from memory). You could call this memoir an act of revenge, but I doubt if this description applies to all of Winterson’s work. In a mature writer, I look for nuance. I think most mature readers do. Winterson’s “revenge” memoir is also a tribute to reading, which saved her. I didn’t intend to go on and on, but the proposition is so interesting.
Rona, precisely! That is what I so cherished about these students of mine. Nothing was set in stone. Nothing that I said was the final word. Everything caused me to reconsider. And here is something I've been turning over for nearly a year now—or perhaps nine months. I love the responses here, and how all of you are adding to the discussion, layering nuance in, meaning. Writing is a collective search. It is never one definitive answer. (And I love the Winterson, remember that quote just as you do. You and I might have the same memory.)
Every day a school day!!
Provocative. I might agree with your student in the sense of why are we even writing the book if one part of us isn't inherently thinking, I want them all to listen to ME. But I have to ponder a bit more.
Leslie, I was actually thinking about you when I was writing (and rewriting) this. I was thinking how rounded your stories are, how dimensional, how fierce and yet how not revenge. I think we all write for our very own reasons. My own work, for example, has a small audience so I never really think about being heard. I write because I'm physically unwell when I don't. I publish here because it gives me a sense of completion and bc I adore this community. Those are just my reasons — my weird personal stuff. In any case, I think in the end it comes down to this: Listen to me because my version of this story is the only possible version of this story. Or listen to me because I have worked so hard to understand and this is where I come down on things.
How I wish we could sort this out for ourselves over a cup of coffee/glass of wine! Thanks, as always, for making me think, for reminding me of the urgency of our work. xoxox
I agree with you, Beth. I thought of my own writing, my own motives, as I read this. Yes...there are times when I write with a need to be right...to stick it to the man (he may or may not be orange), but much of my writing comes from my desire to pave the way for others...and I'd rather have a heart filled with love and compassion rather than anger and revenge any day.
I've written early drafts that feel one dimensional to me. When I read through them I realize that complexity will not just tell a truer story. It will tell a better one. But sometimes, Linda, actions or people defy compassion. And so we make our choices, with the facts as they are. You are always compassionate, in the posts that I read.
Yes...there are people I can't make look better if I'm truthful. I do always have that old idiom in my mind, "Hurt people hurt people." It doesn't excuse behavior, as we all have a choice, but it helps me to keep from ending up a bitter old woman. LOL
I'm with you Linda. I hope I write to pave the way for others not for revenge.
I think when writing memoir esp one has to be careful it isn't for revenge.
Diane, yes absolutely. Memoir is the trickiest of all genres when it comes to this possibility, or opportunity, of revenge.
I've heard it said that writing itself is an act of revenge, an "I'll show them I really can do this!" Meaning not that the content of the writing is vengeful, but the very act of speaking out is an assertion, a triumph, and in some ways a revenge. I can sort of see that point but don't fully agree with it and don't think of it as absolute.
The older I get, the fewer absolutes I see. I don't know what I could ever say about "all of writing" that would be universally true! So there's another question: *Are* there any absolutes, *anything* that is true of "every book?"
Oh, Jenn. I love this perspective. This perhaps. This no absolutes. Today is feeling so very dark to me. Nothing certain. Hoping beyond all definitions for compassion. In the world. And in our work.
Jenn, I had a similar idea related to the act of speaking out rather than the words themselves. When I saw the title of the post, my immediate thought was that writing, getting words out there (no matter the size of the audience), is an act of revenge against those trying to extinguish creativity, love, beauty, and the sacred from our world. Not all writing does this, but I think the idea applies to those of us writing to mine the deeper parts of our existence.
Monica, this post has brought in so many interesting voices, so many points of view—the perfect Substack gathering. I read your words, sit back, and think about who tries to extinguish us, and why. And then remember all those who say, We're listening. We're here. Go on. A tempestuous sea of yes and no out there, as we write.
I think we see everything through the lens we were trained in, and later others’ lens we try on along the way, which colors how we view and see self and other. And since another’s lens isn’t our truth, it’s a layered life we acquire and attempt to navigate. I’ve been thinking about the word “complexity” for years along with “vulnerability,” these words, which perhaps, we impose upon our lives and writing. I wonder if at times, they’re used as bulwarks to keep others from asking of us the hard questions, and to ward off our asking ourselves the same. So perhaps in writing towards perceived complexity, we’ll peel those layers, and a perspective will be revealed that allows us to trust ourselves.
Char, I really do believe that if we keep asking the hard questions about the whole story we will find the version that is most true to ourselves. The one that we can and will defend for all of time, knowing that we have dug deep, knowing that we've given the tale the full 360 degrees.
Wow, that is a challenging piece, I am breathless😲.
I wonder should I reread my Dad's memoirs with the possibility of 'the final word' in mind?
Janey, oh, and now I sit with your note and ponder it. I would never want any of my posts to feel like acts of insistence. Only of the suggested: Perhaps let's look at this in a new way..... perhaps.
My family history is complicated - my brother's memories, his questioning of mine, and my son's similar questions about his childhood have thrown up all sorts of uncertainties.
But it is certainly an interesting idea...I wonder who your student was quoting? And did they pursue the line of thought? 🤔
"Uncertanties" must be the Word of the Week, Janey, as my stack yesterday was on uncertainty (lol) and how it clears the deck of future and past, can bring a new seeing of life.:)
Brilliant essay, Beth.
thank you, my brilliant friend.
Very interesting. I disagree with the student, but I admire her pluck. She may be revengeful, but I certainly am not. Perhaps she will be more successful than I have been as a result, but we all have to write our stories, fictional or true(ish).
Beth, I just saw this note! I love the pluck of my student, too — and the conversation this is generated here.
I write to know, to understand, to grow. If that helps a reader to know, to understand, to grow along with me I have done my job.
Oh, much to think about here. Perhaps, anger and the need to write our own version of events gets us to the page, but I don’t think we can end there. Or else, we become stuck in that hard place. For me, there must be movement toward light, toward a redemption, not necessarily of the other, but of our own life and journey.
‘perhaps’ trumps ‘settled’
collective search and rescue
all works in progress